And for the first time ever, Blizzard causes Loot Drama! /sarcasm
LYL Peeps - please see ETA below!

If you’ve raided at all within the past few weeks, you have no doubt noticed a very significant change Blizzard made in how BoP items are handled. Within two hours of a person looting that item, it can be traded to anyone else who was eligible for it. This is due quite a bit to how when Loot Masters made a mistake in the past, several people would actually have to make a GM ticket in order to get the problem fixed, when an item was accidentally given to the wrong person. Loot Mastering for a 25 man raid is a nightmare. Mistakes happen, and this change to BoP items was instended to help with that. I mean, isn’t it great? So much more flexibility! No more worries about accidental Loot Master errors! Loot Masters can now sit back and relax!

WRONG.

What a nightmare. This has caused so many new loot problems that have absolutely no enforceable or controllable solution, that our raiding team is practially in uproar. I suppose for people who raid with DKP, this isn’t a problem at all.

What is really sad, is that most of the problems are caused by people trying to be generous and help one another out.

We run on a tier system. An item drops, people roll on it, and whoever wins it moves down a tier. There are exceptions and open rolls for various things, like Runed Orbs, etc. People are given a certain amount of time to roll for loot, and then rolls are taken and closed down. There is no perfect amount of time to give people for rolling. Some people feel rushed, some feel like it’s taking too long.

What is happening is that people are rolling for an item and winning, and then experiencing what I call “roller’s remorse” afterwards. They now have the item, and they realize that it would have been a better upgrade to someone else who rolled, so they are kind and give the item to the person who would better benefit from it.

It sounds great. It sounds like exactly the sort of attitude we like to foster and encourage amongst our raiders. It is a complete nightmarish headache however.

At first we were giving people back their tiers and adjusting tiers when this happened. That adds even more time, confusion, and complication to looting. The second problem is that if this is the equivalent of withdrawing one’s roll, shouldn’t the item go to the person who would have won the item had the winner not rolled? Sometimes people were not giving it to the person next in line. Sometimes it can be hard to tell, because due to it being a tier system, one person might technically roll higher than another, but lose due to being on a different tier.

And the worst of all is that this system allows a conspiratorial maliciousness I never would have expected amongst our raiders – and is very difficult to prove has even happened.

Multiple people can get together and decide that tonight they are going to essentially “donate” all their tiers to one player. So they all roll together on items, and then whoever wins the item gives it to the designated player. It’s shady, and it’s unfair to those who don’t have multiple people rolling on items for them.

It brings up all kinds of loot debates. On one side, you can argue, you won the item – you can do whatever you want with it, including give it to whomever you choose. If you want to use your tier for a friend, is that your right? And then… how can we even prevent this? We have no way to control how items are handed about after it has been given to a player. There are different ways we can police it, but all these methods require a measure of time and effort on behalf of our officers that is not really reasonable for a casual raiding alliance.

Ideally you should be able to trust the people with whom you raid. Ideally everyone is working for the benefit of the whole raid. Ideally everyone likes one another, and wouldn’t go out of their way to simply screw another player over.

Ideally I could pull hundred dollar bills and flowers out of my butt.

I spent all day yesterday dealing with these loot issues and trying to find resolutions, and I suspect I will spend most of today trying to figure out if others have had these problems, and if there is any hope, EVER, that Blizzard will change this system, though I’m not feeling too hopeful.

What about you? Have you had any problems with this? Share with me your loot drama stories via comment so I don’t feel so bad about my own!

ETA (9/30/09) - There is a LOT of traffic coming to this page from the Lose Your Life forums - hai guyz welcome - I can't read the forum post that directs to this page. Are ya'll having a similar problem or did everyone just like the Loot Whore picture I found? ;) I'd love to know what ya'll's forum post said, if anyone would be kind enough to put it in the comments section here.

ETA - I have been scouring the forums, and have found very little on this subject - maybe it's just still too new of a change? I'm not sure, however BobTurkey made a really interesting post about it and the Black Market - you should check it out.

6 Responses
  1. bobturkey Says:

    This is pretty similar to the black market I posted about.

    http://bobturkey.wordpress.com/2009/08/16/the-black-market/

    I've come to a conclusion that it is more of a people issue than a system issue. In my opinion, if people do this sort of thing more than once they need to be managed. Repeat offenders probably shouldn't recieve loot as they are effetively short circting your agreed loot distribution system.

    Gobble gobble


  2. Bojangles00 Says:
    This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

  3. Jessabelle Says:
    This comment has been removed by the author.

  4. Jessabelle Says:

    @bobturkey

    It is the exact same problem just a different loot system. I commented back on your blog, but you already know that XD I'm going to add your link to my post, because very few people are even mentioning this problem!


  5. Betelgeuse Says:

    ROFL! LYL gets called out. We just have a bunch of forum trolls. We have a few people grumble about our loot system, we use epgp. Nothing to bad anymore. EPGP more less fixed most of our problems. They way I see it if someone wants to use their GP and give it someone else, let them. It is their GP they want to use. As far as I know we haven't had an issue with black market trades. I realized it could be an issue with the changes, but I don't want to police my guildies like they are kindergartners. I try and give them some amount of trust. ;-)

    BTW, if you want to follow our thread, not much there, PM [LYL]Betelguese and I'll grant you access.


  6. Jessabelle Says:

    @Betelgeuse

    Well I didn't know what EPGP was so I looked it up on wowwiki, and I just wanna say... math is hard. I think that effectively covers my input on that loot system!

    There is no loot system that will not entail at least some grumbles.

    And yeah, this blog doesn't really get that much traffic except on some of my guides, so a sudden two day spike of tons of traffic to this one old post from a month ago *was* pretty obvious, haha - but I'm certainly not complaining!

    Keep your private forums private, no worries - was just trying to figure out if anyone else was having any problems with the 2 hour tradeable loot change!

    And thanks for all the added viewers, haha!


Creative Commons License
Miss Medicina by Miss Medicina is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial-Share Alike 3.0 United States License.
Based on a work at missmedicina.blogspot.com.
Permissions beyond the scope of this license may be available at missmedicina.blogspot.com.